‘Dope Thief’ Star Wagner Moura Explains That Inevitable Ending

[This story contains major spoilers from the season finale of Dope Thief, “Innocent People.”]

Dope Thief, the Apple TV+ limited series from Ridley Scott and Peter Craig, has wrapped its eight-episode run.

Adapted from Dennis Tafoya’s 2009 debut novel, the series followed self-appointed leader Ray (Brian Tyree Henry, also an executive producer) and his friend Manny (Wagner Moura), with whom he is trauma-bonded with while incarcerated. With limited options to generate money, Ray has the pair pose as DEA agents to shake down small-time drug dealers. They hit a life-threatening snag, however, when a score on bad intel results in an anonymous drug kingpin being determined to kill them. Even worse, the real DEA undercover agent Mina (Marin Ireland) who, unknown to Ray and Manny, survived the attack, is helping the investigation while barely holding on to life. With that information, the DEA is convinced that Ray, especially, is also a kingpin, so Ray and Manny must escape them, too. 

Unlike Ray, Manny has no ego, making him more willing to follow. As a Brazilian immigrant who had no family growing up, Manny feels even more abandoned than Ray, who has had his “Ma” in Kate Mulgrew’s Theresa. Because of that, Ray is the family Manny never had. Falling head over heels in love with Sherry (Liz Caribel Sierra) complicated that, however, when, not only is Ray jealous, since he’s still haunted by the death of his girlfriend whom he loved, he also felt entitled to Manny’s complete loyalty. So, even as they stand together, they bump heads throughout the series. It also doesn’t help that Manny is more out of control in his drug addiction than Ray. Whereas Ray moves in life more stoically, Manny can’t hide his emotions, and that kind of vulnerability in this fight for survival is a weakness.

Pulling off a layered character like Manny takes skill, and Wagner Moura does it effortlessly. The Brazilian actor, who portrayed real-life notorious Colombian drug kingpin Pablo Escobar in Netflix’s trailblazing series Narcos in his breakthrough role, stepped out of his comfort zone again to play Manny, a role that he landed only days before filming, but jumped at to work with Ridley Scott, a personal hero.

The Hollywood Reporter spoke with Moura virtually from his native Brazil to talk about Dope Thief, working with Scott, building chemistry with Henry on the fly, how Manny represents another side of the drug trade where defenseless young men are caught in a cycle created by unfortunate circumstances, and the tragic and heartbreaking ending to Manny that he says we had to see coming.

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Is Dope Thief your first time working with Ridley Scott? What did you learn from the experience?

That was one of the things that made me want to do it. When I spoke with Ridley and Peter for the first time, we spoke on Friday and they wanted me to be on set Monday. My first reaction was to say, “I can’t do this,” because I always valued preparation. But I was like, “Okay, this is Ridley Scott, man, you want to work with me.” It was an opportunity to work with him and I was also looking for something that would make me feel more loose and less prepared. The fact that Ridley Scott was directing was a major factor. He’s a hero of mine. And it was insane. My first days were really crazy because I was literally learning the lines on the airplane. Then when I landed, they were in a hurry because they had shot that episode before with another actor and had to reshoot it, and Ridley is known for shooting really fast. He shoots with six cameras at the same time and sometimes you don’t even know where the cameras are.

I really learned a lot and it brought me lots of confidence about what I can do as an actor. Most of all, it was an opportunity to be on set with the man who directed Blade Runner, who directed Thelma and Louise, Alien, Gladiator, oh my god. And he’s so cool. It’s great when you [work] with a hero of yours and it’s great. He called me after the first week just to say, “Hey mate. Just want to say, it’s great.” I’m loving it.’ That’s something [to have] Ridley Scott call me to say, it’s great.

Many people know you from playing Pablo Escobar in Narcos and in Dope Thief, Manny is a very different role but in the same sort of world. Talk about the differences between playing a very aggressive role as Pablo Escobar and this very vulnerable one as Manny.

Our show is violent like Narcos, but with Manny and Ray, and especially Manny, what I love about them is that they’re not fit for that job. They don’t want to be there. It’s just another immigrant, another Latino guy who was told his value was that, and he sort of believed it. Two dudes that were incarcerated since they were 16, the Black man and a Latino guy, like another statistic of incarcerated minorities.

The tragic thing about Manny is that he discovers h might have the chance to have another life, but it might be too late for him. It’s a classic Greek tragedy character, those characters who walk to a very tragic end, and there’s nothing that can stop it from happening. And it’s beautiful because he tries, he really tries. Pablo wanted to be what he was; Manny didn’t want to be part of that. It’s life and social injustice and that kind of shit that has him here.

How did you and Brian create the kind of chemistry that Ray and Manny have?

That was really crazy because I didn’t know Brian. I was summoned three, four days before, and it is so hard really to create that intimacy with someone you don’t know. Even in productions nowadays, they don’t give the actors the space to create that. I love rehearsals. I know some actors don’t, but I think it’s a space for you to know the other actor and spend time with them, so, therefore, when you go to the scene, you have some sort of connection with the person that appears on screen. With Brian, we didn’t have time. So I’m so glad it was an immediate connection, maybe forced by the circumstances.

I met him when we were already in our costumes as Manny and Ray. We were walking to set. I was like, “This is insane; I don’t know this guy and he’s supposed to be my brother…. Stop guys, please, I need a second.” I took Brian to this green room and stood in front of him, held his hands and said, “My name is Wagner Moura. I’m Brazilian. I have three sons.” I started to talk a bit about myself, and he looked at me and did the same. That moment that we shared in a very rushed circumstance really connected us. I think we would be friends if we met [during] another opportunity. Our souls connected, fortunately.

But that also works with the relationship, because there’s tension between Manny and Ray. Though they are like brothers, there is tension because Manny wants to go another way.

It’s a toxic relationship. But this happens with people who love each other. They love each other, but that relationship is not healthy for Manny anymore. He wants to have a life with Sherry. He wants to have his own autonomy. Ray is a very control freak guy and he embraces Manny in a way that it’s hard for him to escape, because he loves Ray. It’s a tragic love story, it’s a love story between two dudes. Two guys who really love each other but are not well equipped to make this relationship healthy as a good friendship should be.

His relationship with his love Sherry is one of the sweetest sides we get to see of Manny. He looks like he’s really in love.

I love that you see that because I think he is one of the sweetest characters I’ve played, and one of the most vulnerable characters I’ve played. He really loves Sherry; he really wants to have a life with her. And he really loves Ray as well. If these characters had come from maybe another social place, they would be able to pay for a therapist or maybe if they were fed with love when they were children, they would be well-equipped to deal with these challenges. I feel that also Ray and Manny behave like two teenagers. They were frozen [into] the age when they were incarcerated, and they sort of behave in that way as two adults, and Manny starts to understand that and tries to run away from it but he can’t. Manny is an artist, right? He draws on Ray’s cast, and in his house, there are many drawings of Sherry that he did. So he has this artistic thing, but he’s engulfed in violence.

Also, he’s an addict. How did you prepare for that part of it? Have you played addicts before?

I played one in the show for Apple TV+ called Shining Girls. It’s Elisabeth Moss. It’s such a great show. Check it out. I play a journalist who is also an alcoholic. It’s another thing that’s part of, unfortunately…

This cycle?

Yeah exactly. This cycle is just part of it. Both Ray and Manny were introduced to drugs since they were little, and it seems like they cannot get away from there. They both spent the entire show trying, going to AA meetings and things like that, not being able to get away from the destiny that was designed for them. Unfortunately, in real life, few Mannys and Rays manage to escape that. Coming from Brazil, I’ve seen that in the favelas; it’s hard. It’s hard when you’re told since you were little this is your only way, this is your value. It’s hard to escape.

How hard was it to play the scenes in the prison where they attack Manny?

It was very demanding, physically and emotionally. We had that grenade scene in episode four. All our scenes are very emotional. My scenes with Brian are both of us screaming at each other. But we have a scene in episode seven that’s really heartbreaking. One of the things I really like about the show is that the scenes were very dramatic and demanding emotionally, but also very funny, right? That’s the way it is in life, right? You’re going through a complicated thing, and then you make it light. But it’s something that says a lot about Peter Craig’s writing. He is a very, very, very, very good writer.

Let’s zero in on the tragic, heroic part when Manny, I think, decides that “I’m going to just die.” (He kills himself by overdosing on heroin.) Maybe it’s a noble thing to do, but it’s crushing. Take us into the mindset of why Manny makes that choice.

I love that episode because it’s like he was pushed to a point. But there was no other solution. Would he betray Ray? I don’t think so.

But did Ray betray him?

No, I don’t think so either. But then Sherry shows up saying she’s pregnant, and can you imagine for a kid that was abandoned when he was little to have to think that now I can be a father? So he was in a situation where there was no way out. He’s a classic tragic character. We know since day one when we see Manny that something awful is going to happen to him, and it happens.

I remember when Peter Craig called me to say that Manny was going to die, it was almost as if he was talking about a member of the family: “I have to tell you this, and, oh, man, my heart is broken.” I was like, “What’s going on Peter?” and he says, “I think it’s not going to end well for Manny.” But I sort of knew that already. [Manny] says, “I’m not strong enough.” And he’s not; he’s not strong. And Ray, in one scene, says to him, “They went straight to you because you’re weak” in a very mean way. But it’s not that he’s weak.

He’s supposed to be somewhere else.

Yeah, he’s supposed to be somewhere else. Exactly, and he wanted to be, and he discovered that late. Had he discovered that he could be someone else before, maybe his life could be [different] but it was too late for him. He was put in a situation where [it was either] Sherry and the baby or Ray, and he was like, “I prefer to die.”

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All eight episodes of Dope Thief are now streaming on Apple TV+.